The Coffee House Wall – 23rd/29th November

Posted on November 24, 2015

This is the Coffee House Wall for this week. I won’t say that it is your chance to communicate with us, as we are all in this together. It is, nevertheless, the Conservative Blog post that has no particular theme, and where everything is on topic. Let’s just remember that we want to avoid ad hominem attacks on others. We don’t want to engage with trolls. We want to moderate our language ourselves as responsible and mature adults, choosing to use fruity language only where it is necessary. This is our opportunity to show what the Spectator Coffee House Wall could have been like.

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251 thoughts on “The Coffee House Wall – 23rd/29th November”

  1. READ ALL ABOUT IT!
    Turkish warplanes have reportedly shot down a Russian military aircraft on the border with Syria.
    Russia’s Interfax news agency cited the Russian defence ministry as saying that a Su-24 had crashed in northern Syria, and that its two pilots had ejected.
    Turkish military officials said Turkish F-16s had shot down the plane after warning its pilots that they were violating Turkish airspace.
    Video footage showed the plane crashing into mountains in Latakia province.
    Russia launched an air campaign to bolster Syrian President Bashar al-Assad’s government in late September.
    It says it has targeted only “terrorists”, but activists say its strikes have mainly hit Western-backed rebel groups.
    Turkey, a staunch critic of Mr Assad, has repeatedly warned against violations of its airspace by Russian and Syrian aircraft.
    Last month, Ankara said Turkish F-16s had intercepted a Russian jet that crossed its border and two Turkish jets had been harassed by an unidentified Mig-29.
    ON BBC WEB WHAT NOW?

  2. The last paragraph in the quote says it all:
    US intelligence officials have ‘underestimated’ Isil’s plan to attack the West
    In echoes of the criticisms after the 9/11 attacks, a top former intelligence official and Iraq expert has said the CIA and other key spy agencies are drawing flawed conclusions about the nature and intent of the jihadist group

    “Mr Harvey, who worked for the Defence Intelligence Agency in Iraq, and later as the director of Afghanistan-Pakistan for the Pentagon’s Central Command said he had quit in frustration at the intelligence community’s “lack of creativity” when it came to thinking about and understanding jihadist insurgencies.
    He said that because the jihadist group behaved differently to Al-Qaeda, which focuses on “bigger, high profile” attacks, the agencies were underestimating the Isil threat.
    He described an institution where little importance is given to experience, with key positions focused on the Middle East being filled by “young people” who had never been to the countries they were analysing. Little attention has been paid, he said, to the jihadists’ ideology and literature.”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/12013132/US-intelligence-officials-have-underestimated-Isils-plan-to-attack-the-West.html

  4. Turkey

    well turkey could ask NATO countries to stand up to their treaty obligations and defend turkey against russia.

    and if the rest of NATO says no? what then for NATO?

  8. Malfleur
    November 23rd, 2015 – 21:32
    On November 23, 1790 a Russian army of 31,000 men invested the Turkish city of Izmail on the Danube in the Ukraine. Prince Potemkin, then in Bender, knew that none of the generals leading the army could take the fortress.

  9. Alexsandr – 11:31

    Russia, who didn’t like Baroness Ashton invading the Ukraine either, is fighting ISIL. We are on the same side as the French 🙂 , because they are also fighting ISIL. Germany, along with Boris J and CMD, wants Turkey in the EU, but Turkey are cooperating with ISIL, like buying their oil. No wonder Turkey is shooting down a Russian plane. They also attack the minority tribes, like the Kurds, who are also attacked by ISIL.

    Belgium, or Brussels to be exact, is exporting terrorism to France, while the Brussels ‘elite’ are doing nothing to stop the flow of economic immigrants: quite the reverse!

    And then we have this:

    German Police Intercepted Car With Eight AK-47s, Grenades, TNT, Paris Programmed Into Satnav
    “The car wasn’t only being driven west. Bavarian interior minister Joachim Herrmann has confirmed that based on “the data of the man’s [GPS] navigation system, and his cell phone there is strong evidence that the man wanted to go to France”. German media have reported he specifically had Paris programmed into his sat-nav.

    The Bavarian prime minister Horst Seehofer confirmed German security services believe the arrested individual may have been related to the terror cell who killed over 120 across Paris on Friday evening.

    From the moment he was arrested the suspect has maintained total silence and hasn’t even taken a lawyer, reports Focus.de. German police will now be under pressure if it transpires they failed to gather intelligence from the suspect that could have helped French terror police foil last night’s attacks in Paris.

    Austrian paper Die Kronen Zeitung reports the very foundations of the European free movement Schengen area will be shaken by the arrest.”

    http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/11/14/german-police-check-found-car-eight-ak-47s-grenades-tnt-paris-programmed-satnav/

    Read that last paragraph again! The Germans, in their ‘ever closer union’ didn’t tell the French of their discovery, in Paris or anywhere else!

    And then we have Britain, who really want to trade with the Rest of the World, and could help the military effort, if it is helping, and if they have the planes, by increasing to bomb Iraq, replacing ally planes that could bomb Syria instead. But CMD doesn’t think it is face saving enough, and it would be going against everything he stands for: it would be a sensible plan to support our allies (well, at least France), with a credible exit policy.

  10. Frank P – 12:00

    Your link doesn’t work. Did you mean this:
    Germans Opposed to Mass Migration are “Free to Leave”
    “German voters are beginning to wake up to the true cost — financial, social and otherwise — of the migration crisis, but they apparently do not have much say about the future direction of their country. According to Walter Lübcke, the district president of Kassel, a city in state of Hesse, citizens who disagree with the government’s open-door immigration policy are ‘free to leave Germany.'”

    http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6944/germans-oppose-mass-migration

    We could welcome German refugees, but we wouldn’t know if they were part of the elite.

  11. RR (13:20)

    Yes, that’s the one.

    The question is, how long before the same situation arises here, if indeed it’s not already occurring in parts of the Metropolis and some provincial cities – which most of us here believe.

    I’m still struggling to see what Mutti envisages. I know she is an erstwhile Comintern apparatchik, but does she think she can corral the jihadists into that faith. Is it just staffing for the German heavy industrial need? If so surely she must know the inherent dangers in that devil-or-deep-sea vision. Or has she just gone bonkers under the pressures of her office? Looks like a serious civil war is imminent in Germany. That’s potentially more serious for us than the Near East melee.

  14. DT: The Mayor of Brussels has accused the Belgian government of imposing an “Islamic regime” on the city after the terrorism lockdown saw bars, restaurants and schools shut.

    Nothing to do with the EU: it’s the Belgian Government’s fault!

  15. This is a massive breakthrough, but will Obama, CMD and the rest change course:

    German Professor: NASA Has Fiddled Climate Data On ‘Unbelievable’ Scale

    “Professor Dr. Friedrich Karl Ewert is a retired geologist and data computation expert. He has painstakingly examined and tabulated all NASA GISS’s temperature data series, taken from 1153 stations and going back to 1881. His conclusion: that if you look at the raw data, as opposed to NASA’s revisions, you’ll find that since 1940 the planet has been cooling, not warming.”

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/11/24/german-professor-nasa-fiddled-climate-data-unbelievable-scale

    Someone was fiddling the data!

  16. What next? War with Russia?
    Turkey shoots down Russian war plane.The crew parachute out and are shot dead in the air by Turkaman militia as they come down over Syrian territory;according to news reports.Turkey calls a meeting of NATO at 4pm.

  19. With the world and the news the way it is , it’s a pleasure to read about the Hatton garden robbery.
    One could almost think we were back in the 60s if it wasn’t for the state of the art Hilti drilling kit.
    The meetings in pubs , hiding the stash in cemeteries and behind skirting boards, someone unidentified ( as if ) opening a fire door for them.
    Oh dear , I’m coming over all nostalgic.

  21. Noa

    My apologies, I missed the second link in your 1200 post, too, and inadvertantly repeated it when I got my daily newsletter from Gatestone. That’s what comes from using this fiddling tablet, scrolling is a chore and it flies all over the shop. It’s handy for watching the Telly simultaneously, though. ☺

  24. John Birch (16:11)

    Bwaahahahaha! You can imagine how I feel. I think another ‘Plus ça change …’ is in order. I can guess at the story behind the story. I’d like a word with FF. The one that’s still alive. Still at it and the same hot line to the Three Feet. ☺
    Not to mention another to the Insurance brokers.

  26. Obysmal to Hollande,
    ‘We stand by our friends in good times and bad – no matter what …’

    What a begrudging opening staza. Fucking dickhead!!

    No matter what??!!! WTF does that imply?

  27. Obysmal to Hollande,
    ‘We stand by our friends in good times and bad – no matter what …’

    What a begrudging opening staza. Fucking dickhead!!

    No matter what??!!! WTF does that imply?

  28. Followed by a tsunami of personal sentimentality and gush.

    “65 nations involved in a united coalition.” Oh really, Obysmal? When was that? In your dreams or in your deception?

    “I intend to send in a team of experts …”

    FFS!!

    I can’t stand any more of this shit!

  29. Meanwhile, in the real world, the Turks push their luck by shooting down a Russky kite, which was bombing another bunch of insurgents who are probably on ‘our’ side. Maybe.
    Not!

  31. A minor and somewhat insignificant power, confident of protection of a greater military might launches a lethal attack on a much greater power. Anyone discern echos of Sarajevo? Serbia was not worth the consequences of the assassination of Franz Ferdinand and Turkey is not worth the destabilasation of Europe.

  32. RobertRetyred 16.45

    It seems illogical and an act of misplaced ‘humanity’, to reject the shells, but admit the wombs that will create many more of them.

  33. Noa – 19:50

    Did you mean 16:35?

    There was only information about the single men, so I reserve judgement on the rest, and their numbers 🙂

    I was comparing them with our ‘liberal’ government.

  34. The Turks wouldn’t have dared shooting down the fighter without the nod from the Americans. It’s a provocation, the Russians will repay, the Kurds may be the beneficiaries, getting some up-to-date Russian anti-aircraft gear, probably via a proxy, Iran may be it. The Iranians have ordered the S-300 system.

    The downing of the plane is a warning to the KGB Colonel from the honorary Muslim in the White House not to overdo it. Baron has said when the Russians got involved that their bigger enemy than ISIL will be the scheming troika – the Americans, the Saudis and the Turks. It still holds true. Not one of them wants ISIS to be destroyed, not only did the Saudis funded the thugs, they, the religiously motivated bastards, are the Saudis best bet in their effort to get rid of Assad. The Turks want Assad punished for his support for the Kurds. The Americans promised the Saudis to get rid of him, too. Assad goes, the Saudis will cut oil output, prices will bet boosted, the American shale pumping will resume again.

    This incident may not be the last. The area is one of the routes through which oil gets smuggled to Turkey (so much for the Turks fighting ISIL), it was, still is, the major source of funds for the religiously motivated thugs.

    One can only hope the KGB Colonel keeps his cool, we don’t need a Christmas with missiles flying around.

  35. Frank P @ 18:01

    That’s a good one, Frank, and timely, too. The ISIL revenue from oil smuggling to Turkey (they also sold oil to Iraq, mind boggles) is on the way down, the $15mn will come handy. The boy should do more wired clocks, take it to shopping centres, airports and places like that.

  37. Frank P @ 17:06

    You’re too nice to the man, Frank, his presidency hangs in a balance, the security services under his watch fugged up again so soon after the Charlie atrocity. When the jury gets out, and it will, he may be toast, hence he’s overdoing it.

    Wait what happens when the retailers figure they’re to lose the best time of the year to make money.

  38. RobertRetyred @ 16:35

    Liberal or not, Robert, they know which side the bread’s buttered, it’s only the fugging EU that plays the good samaritans, we suffer.

    Baron was on a train today, (far longer than he should have been, a signal failure again). The debating of the EU response to immigration cannot be reported here, so strong was the animosity, Baron had to play the devil’s advocate role, not too much though, and he stopped altogether when one of the participants said what he would do to them (and the Germans), and he probably meant it, too.

  39. John birch @ 16:11

    Millions involved then, John, and nobody got shot. Today, one gets murdered for a fiver.

  42. Frank P @ 23:06

    You should know more about it, Frank, but in general, it’s true, in the ‘barbaric’ Britain, villains didn’t carry, they knew the consequences if they did. That’s right, is it not?

  43. Everything suggests, Frank, that Mr. Boot may indeed be the one who beats the wisdom of the Chinese that ‘man can predict everything but the future’. There is a joker in the pack though, well millions of them arriving at Europe’s shores. It may be they will have a big say, the referendum may not be even necessary.

    Stranger things have happened, you know.

  44. In these days of draconian spying:

    O, evil Facebook warriors,
    Soldiers of the Whatsapp army,
    O ye deputy sheikhs of Google,
    You run in a vicious circle
    Clicking on the top right corner.

  46. This lasts for around 20 minutes, but you can shave, have a cup of tea, or just sit comfortably listening to it. It’s a good summary of Turkey’s duplicity, it also explains what the Russians were bombing in the area, and why Turkey had a go.

    http://stopimperialism.org

  47. Baron (08:43)

    Very interesting, but the platform from which it was launched injects another element of multiplicity that makes it impossible to qualify its intelligence value. There is data there to be extracted for inclusion into the mix. And there is little doubt that all parties involved in this cauldron of crap are pushing their luck because the POTUS is weak as piss. And that means that he’s gambling with our chips.

    Thanks for posting it – I think!! ☺

  48. Baron (00:57)

    In general, yes, that’s right. But there were always the exceptions to the rule and some of those cases didn’t surface for public consumption. Where vast sums of money were involved in the conspiracies, certain tidying up arrangements involved both shooters and pig farms. But I shouldn’t have to teach grandma to suck eggs, surely?

    I know … I know: “Don’t call me Shirley!”

  51. Baron,
    Your posting of 24th. 22-30. was one of the best expositions of the Russo/Turkish debacle I have read, either here on the wall or elsewhere, a tour de force. And no my old son, they never will learn, their egos will not permit such an indulgence, besides the study of history is elitist. God forbid that the panjandrums who so relentlessly encourage the lobotomising of the education system should learn from the errors of the past.

  55. Could anyone please click on the link below, tell Baron if you can get the video going. It comes from the TV Rain outfit, shows an angry trucker essentially lambasting Putin (and Medvedev), saying they do FA, have no real job. The TV station ifs full of the long distance truckers gripes, moans and grievances, unfortunately the barbarian has no time to listen all this.

    The reason he would like you to hit the link is to find out if you can watch the video. Baron can, he has a subscription, you don’t.

  56. RobertRetyred @ 14:37

    Two things the writer fails to mention, Robert. During the cold war, Turkey wasn’t closely allied with the West anyway, the country played it both ways. Even today, NATO planes are not allowed to use Turkish airspace.

    It puzzles why they shot the fighter jet, they have two big projects going with the Russians (a nuclear power station, an oil pipeline by-passing Ukraine). It’s out of character, too, and Baron sticks to his take of it, it’s the Americans that were the originators of the idea, Turkey obliged not because their double dealing with ISIS (oil, foodstuff, building materials and stuff) got unmasked (everyone knew about it anyway), but because Erdogan had to placate the two families with pedigrees going back to the Ottoman Empire that run the country (the Koc and Sabanci families). It’s they that lost a lucrative business, the Turkish top man had to show them he can punish those fugging their profitable side business, Baron reckons.

  57. Radford NG @ 14:14

    As Capt Mainwaring says ‘well spotted’, Radford (only joking), it could indeed be connected, the Turks like many other southern tribes keep grudges for ever (even though they didn’t do badly in the campaign). Let us hope the police track the culprits.

  58. stephen maybery @ 12:54

    You’re too kind, stephen.

    Not many people are aware of a deal the Saudis made with the Americans way back the last century, after the Yom Kippur war (the Saudis embargoed the US because of the Republic’s support for Israel). For the Saudis willingness to price oil in dollars, the Yanks promised to defend the Kingdom. The dollar pricing is one of the pillars of the the dollar as a reserve currency, the amount of greenbacks circulating outside the US (never expected to be repatriated is massive e.g. eurodollars, the same in Asia).

    No more time to continue t he rant.

  59. Baron.

    Google-ing TV Rain the site name (in Cyrilic )comes up.Clicking on, the home page comes up (which can be translated).The live programme doesnt work;but an offer of ten days free subscription comes up.
    Scrolling down there are various articles,clicking on which provides a text item and/or a brief video clip.An hour long item from yesterdays `Evening Programme`can found.
    (Truckers seem to be incensed at a charge being imposed for `damage to the roads`.)

    There appears to be enough free material (which can be translated to English by Google) to be of interest.

  61. And now for something completely different.
    That great Egyptian stand-up comedian:the late Colonel Nasser.
    He tells of how the leader of the Muslim Brotherhood demanded he make the hijab mandatory.Somebody in the audience shouts:”Let him wear it”.He goes on to tell how he tells the `leader`that he (the`leader)cant make his own daughter wear it,so how can he (Nasser)make 10 million women wear it.
    (The sur-titles can about be read)

    https://youtu.be/iv0agvY3jvo

  62. Radford NG @ 16:00

    Thank you, Radford, no point really for you or anyone else to keep on translating any of the stuff. Baron wanted to find out if you could switch on the video, the one in the link showed a typical burly Russian having a go at the two top people, you would have heard the name of Putin and Medvedev quite clearly, could even guess what he was calling them.

    The station has 50,000+ subscribers, guess is about 3-4times as many viewers. That’s not that many for a country of 130mn (similar to what proportionally the Guardian’s readership is over here), but not because it’s censored, but because people aren’t interested. Baron has said it before (hopes those in governance in the West are aware of it, even though they publicly never say so) the danger to the Russian unwashed as well to the West comes from the right leaning thugs (the nationalists and communists) and not from the Navally’s crowd.

  63. Two young teenage girls from Austria, both good looking, doing modelling in the country of their birth, went to fight with the ISIL thugs two years ago. Before leaving they left a letter saying “Don’t look for us. We will serve Allah — and we will die for him.”

    Well, they didn’t like the ‘fighting’ that much, wanted to return back home, the ISIL thugs killed them, mutilating their young bodies. Just as well their wish to die for Allah came true. (Apologies, it’s rather cruel).

  64. Radford NG @ 16:16

    Touching video, Radford, thanks for posting it. The young people throughout the world would more than likely echo the same sentiment, too, and not only the young, it’s the corrupted politicians, east and west, their thirst for power over us that fucks it for all.

  65. The Russians fly hundreds of missions per day, as do the Americans and the French. Is there always a camera present, positioned in the right spot, at the right time? The navigator who survived said he had flown the route many times before, knew it well, always made sure he stays on the right side of the border.

    The incident was well prepared, organised, it smells of a PR exercise.

    He also said he wasn’t flying over Turkey, wasn’t warned. According to Reuters even the American military confirmed the flight didn’t encroach the Turkish territory. Both the White House, the NATO Council that met at the request of the Turks urged de-escalation.

    In Moscow, a crowd of around a thousands threw stones at the Turkish Embassy, broke some windows before the police stepped in. The Turks suggested the Foreign Secretaries should meet soon to sort things out, the Russians haven’t shown any interest. Putin ordered an escalation in the bombing of the area from which the anti-Assad forces shot the parachuted pilot.

    If the Turks just downed the bomber it would be understandable, it’s one man and his machine against another man and his machine, to arrange for killing the pilot as he parachuted down wasn’t a smart move at all. This is bound to kick them back, it’s reminiscent of the Nazi behaviour. If these are the people the Americans (and the Turks) call the acceptable anti-Assad opposition, then the Syrian unwashed are truly fucked.

    But who knows, if the Russians keep on hitting the brave killers of parachuted pilots they may flee the area, emigrate north, the Mutti will welcome them to the EU, we may have a chance to meet them when out shopping.

  66. Radford NG
    November 25th, 2015 – 14:14
    anne….steven….Baron.
    I am beginning to think it wan’t politically motivated,but rather a gang of uneducated yobs. The behaviour of pupils AND teachers today is too often barbaric.

  68. Baron

    Thank you for your many informed thoughts and observations on events in Russia and Syria.
    Polonium, Putin and Oligarchs notwithstanding it’s time the UK re-established its traditional friendships and alliances with the Bear.

  69. So far, the best on the downing of the Russian bomber came from the Greek Defence Secretary, who said : ‘There are so many violations of the air space of the countries in the region that if we all started downing the violators, we would have no planes left’.

    The Greeks are no friends of the Turks, never have been.

  70. Noa @ 17:55

    Fair trial for a man who deciphers Islam for what it is, in a part of the world run by an honorary Muslim? Hmmm

  71. Noa @ 18:03

    You may have a point, Noa, and we don’t have to be too close to them, Frank won’t have to have a pint with Ivan or Ivanka (that’s a female name, Frank, not many fluid genders in Putin’s Russia), nobody will have to have a holiday in the Crimea either.

    Trading goods, getting the Ruskies to furnish us with cheap oil, supplying us with caviar (Baron likes the stuff) would do nicely.

    Come to think of it, is there anything we could trade with them?

  72. A letter sent to my (Conservative) MP about the forthcoming vote to join the war in Syria.
    Dear Mr …..

    I write, as a constituent to express my concern about the forthcoming vote for the UK to participate in the bombing of Syria and to seek your assurance that you will vote against a measure which will entail substantial risks to the UK whilst offering no benefit to the people and government of Syria.
    I am sure you will make every effort to acquaint yourself with all the pertinent aspects, both internal and external, on this extremely important matter and I therefore confine myself to referring to paragraphs 22 and 23 of the recent Foreign Affairs Committee report:

    ‘In military terms, we noted that although our witnesses believed that a decision to extend airstrikes into Syria would be welcomed by Coalition allies, some said that it would not have anything other than a marginal effect. The experts told us that it would not be likely to involve extra aircraft but would simply re-focus existing assets; that the UK was already contributing valuable surveillance in Syria; and that the ability to conduct airstrikes as well would not have a decisive effect. Sir Simon Mayall concurred, adding:
    “There are not that many of them, actually. This is not an air campaign anything remotely like the scale of 1991 or 2003. We need to be very clear about this. This is not a war-winning air campaign, by any stretch of the imagination.”
    ‘23.As a result, several witnesses concluded that there was little reason for the UK to change its policy. Julien Barnes-Dacey was strongly against the proposal and told us that the airstrikes make the threat from ISIS worse because they “feed a sense of radicalisation”:
    “Sunnis say, ‘Look, the West is not helping us against Assad, but they are fighting ISIS.’ […] We become direct parties, all the while contributing nothing meaningful, in terms of military numbers or capability. I really fail to see how air strikes against ISIS will not do more harm than good.”
    In paragraph 33, the reasoning of the select committee is quite clear:
    ‘…we believe that there should be no extension of British military action into Syria unless there is a coherent international strategy that has a realistic chance of defeating ISIL and of ending the civil war in Syria. In the absence of such a strategy, taking action to meet the desire to do something is still incoherent.’
    35.The Government should explain the following points before asking the House of Commons to approve a substantive motion authorising military action:
    a)On an international strategy:
    i)How the proposal would improve the chances of success of the international coalition’s campaign against ISIL;
    ii)How the proposed action would contribute to the formation and agreement of a transition plan for Syria;
    iii)In the absence of a UN Security Council Resolution, how the Government would address the political, legal, and military risks arising from not having such a resolution;
    iv)Whether the proposed action has the agreement of the key regional players (Turkey; Iran; Saudi Arabia; Iraq); if not, whether the Government will seek this before any intervention;
    v)Which ground forces will take, hold, and administer territories captured from ISIL in Syria.
    b)On the military imperative:
    i)What the overall objective is of the military campaign; whether it expects that it will be a “war-winning” campaign; if so, who would provide war-winning capabilities for the forces; and what the Government expects will be the result of extending airstrikes to Syria.
    ii)What extra capacity the UK would contribute to the Coalition’s actions in Syria.
    36.We are persuaded that it is not yet possible for the Government to give a satisfactory explanation on the points listed above. Until it is possible for the Government to address these points we recommend that it does not bring to the House a motion seeking the extension of British military action to Syria.’
    I am confident that you will be aware of the need to satisfactorily address these arguments and should you choose to vote in favour of intervention be able to explain why you choose to ignore them if you intend to support the path to war.
    Yours sincerely

  74. Baron 18.13

    In addition to oil and gas, it may be safer (and cheaper) for British tourists to take their holidays in the the Black sea, rather than within Sultan Erdogan’s revived Ottoman empire.
    Whether the exchange of Britain’s beer and lard buckets for fossil fuels constitutes fair trading is a separate matter.

  76. Noa @ 18:59

    Weil and rationally argued, plenty of supporting evidence, full of common sense, the letter of yours, Noa.

    Pity, it will be filed in a drawer labelled ‘the waste paper basket’.

    Still, out of camaraderie, Baron will pen a letter, too.

    Who knows what it is that fuels the boy’s craving to start bombing in Syria. If we could make a noticeable contribution towards defeating the ISIS thugs, then he would have at least one leg to stand on. But as both you and the Committee say we cannot.

    The biggest drawback of the bombing (and that includes the Russians) is that there isn’t enough boots to re-occupy then hold what the bombers cleanse. The Syrian Army’s exhausted, the forces that fight it are paid mercenaries, the lot of them, they switch allegiances, the one who pays more buys their loyalty, but would one want to be in this auction when a country’s future’s at stake? Should one be in it?

    It may be his hurt pride blinds him, but he will unquestionably be useful to the Americans if (and when) it comes to drafting the future for this devastated country called Syria.

    There is a poster like picture Baron was sent by one of his friends. It’s that of Margaret’s face, her finger pointing forward. On top it says “if I were in power” and at the bottom “ISIS would now be Was Was”.

  77. Health permitting, Noa, the barbarian has plans to visit the peninsula, he spent many a day basking in the sun, swimming, drinking champagne (many plants around producing the booze when the Red Menace ran the country), and eating fly infested borsch (only when fully stoned, honest) in a place called Sudak (you may google it).

  78. Wanted: a new Chancellor, a lack of self interest, a degree of patriotism, courage, integrity and a willingness to meet promises to balance the books are pre requisites. Vertebrate preferred.

  79. Enjoy that trip, Baron.
    Noa has a hankering to take the Ark and his wife to see the steppes and beyond, once I have retired for good.

  81. Baron

    I have no time for my MP, an ex-military man and fully fledged Cameron toady, he fully supported the court martial and conviction of Sergeant Blackman for murder, justifying the same in verbose, obnoxious and self-serving prose. (I retained his letter to remind myself of what the words ‘unctuous’ and ‘hypocritical’ mean.
    Nor would I vote for him, being a UKIP man..
    Still, I will watch for his reply.
    And how he votes.

  83. Be interested to hear a critique of Boot’s take on the ‘Russian incursion of Turkish air space’. Baron? Noa?

    http://alexanderboot.com/content/parallel-lines-converge-syria

    His nifty/pithy headline is well chosen. I wish I could find fault with his analysis, because it is chilling. I can’t, so over to you Russophile’s. Prognostications would be welcome. Even better if they are optimistic ones, as mine are even worse than Alexander’s – at least he has he pin code to heaven’s gate! I see no ships other than hardships. Unless some ?heavy duty-on-the-ground big (lower case) boots March in to dismantle this burgeoning Caliphate, its mutating and exponential, cancerous growth will cause the kind of chaos that can only end in a nuclear exchange. When that happens, only Dickie Mottram will be able to conjure up an appropriate quote. Please convince me that I am wrong.

  84. COLUMNISTS
    ROD LIDDLE
    The French might as well bomb Belgium

    I am always open to spiritual guidance from any quarter, all the more so if that guidance is of practical import. So I was especially grateful to hear reports of a fatwa from the prominent Saudi Arabian cleric, Abdul Aziz bin Abdullah. This fatwa apparently made it clear that it was perfectly permissible for me, if suffering from ‘severe hunger’, to eat my wife. Either eat all of her — or merely, as it helpfully elucidated, some of her ‘body parts’. It did not say which body parts. In lieu of further enlightenment, I assumed that all of them were up for grabs.
    Anyway, many has been the time that I have rooted through the fridge for something to stave off a ravenous hunger and found nothing but those tiny yoghurts that women eat to assuage constipation. I have stamped around and cursed, not understanding that the answer to my problem was sitting a few yards away in the living room, watching a re-run of Wolf Hall. Some, perhaps including the renowned Quranic scholar David Cameron, will no doubt say that such a fatwa (which Abdul insisted was a fabrication) would exemplify a ‘perverted’ view of Islam. Perhaps. But might it actually be rather moderate in stipulating that this recourse is available only to men suffering ‘severe hunger’? There may be other Muslim clerics who would argue that we should eat our wives even if we feel only a little peckish, or have got the ‘munchies’. The disputed fatwa, by the way, was said to reinforce the thesis that wives should be obedient to their husbands and that eating them was merely another way that ‘2 become 1’, as the Spice Girls once had it.
    It may well be that when you first heard of the barbarous Islamist atrocities in Paris you thought: ‘My God. My God. How could they do that? At least now maybe the scales will fall from some eyes and we will tackle the problem head on.’ And then, like me, having thought this, you will have watched a BBC news programme and very quickly realised — nope, not a chance, business as usual. The same delusional rubbish, the same gerrymandering of public opinion, the same absurdities. My anti-epiphany began with Kirsty Wark on Newsnight interviewing two women, one of whom said that the problem was France’s racist society and the other, a French-Algerian, who opined that it first looked like the attacks could have been caused by rival drug gangs. I stared at the screen, mouth agape, unable for a while to believe what I was hearing. A whole programme about the Paris attacks in which three words — Muslim, Islam, jihadi — were not used at any point. The desperation to exculpate the ideology was present long before the bodies had been carried away. Then, when it was revealed that some attackers had entered the country as refugees, the Today programme had a fair, balanced and unpartisan debate between three people who agreed that we should take more refugees, because getting tough is ‘what they (the nasty terrorists) want us to do’. Even before the attacks the majority of British people wanted fewer migrants to be allowed in and a bit more rigour at the checkpoints — but that view was not remotely reflected. With the exception of a rather fine piece by John Sweeney on Panorama, the BBC’s coverage throughout was appalling in its cringeing, politically correct, liberal bias.
    Meanwhile, the Home Secretary was telling us that the terrorists represent a ‘perverted’ form of Islam. Hmm. The same perverted form of the religion as practised by Abdul’s home country, Saudi Arabia? Or in Iran, or Libya, or Palestine, or Somalia, or . . . the list of countries which kill apostates, persecute Christians, Jews, homosexuals and women is longish, you have to say. We must grasp that the proportion of Muslims worldwide who hold this ‘perverted’ view is far, far, higher than Mrs May or the BBC would like you to think. Some 27 per cent of British Muslims, for example, expressed sympathy with the Charlie Hebdo murderers. This week it was reported that one in five British Muslims sympathises with Islamic State fighters. That is a number which is, as John Major might put it, not inconsiderable.
    The desperation to exculpate the ideology was present long before the bodies of Paris had been carried away
    And the weird canards and the non-sequiturs. I have lost count of the number of times I have heard politicians express worry about British Muslims going to Syria and coming home ‘radicalised’. No. They were radicalised before they went. That is why they went there. In any case, we always let them back in when they arrive home after a spot of decapitating, instead of confiscating their passports and telling them to clear off.
    The point, though, is that Syria facilitates the delusion that these attacks are imposed upon us all by an isolated external agency, when this is not remotely the case. Bombing the Islamic State, which was François Hollande’s response, will not help. It is another means of evading the issue, the real crux of the matter. He would be better off bombing Belgium, where the terrorists lived, or the Paris suburbs — or Manningham, near Leeds, where a few days after the murders a man who had converted from Islam to Christianity was repeatedly stabbed in the street after years of harrassment by adherents of the Religion of Peace. These people are among us and they have been among us for a very long time indeed. Syria may be a magnet for them — in which case, let them be drawn to it! — but please do not kid ourselves that without the Islamic State these atrocities would not have happened. There was no Isis involvement in 9/11, or the London bombings, or the Charlie Hebdo attacks — or any other of the multifarious acts of murder and mayhem perpetrated by Islamists from Kenya to Nigeria to Mali to Israel to Spain to Denmark to oh . . . countless other venues.
    And the refugees, the migrants? Keep them out. Tighten the EU borders and keep them out. They wouldn’t like it here — it’s still a godless, infidel democracy, just about.

  86. Apropos our new Canadian Prime Minister’s promise to bring 25,000 Syrian refugees into Canada by the end of 2015 he now seems to feel obliged to break his promise and instead bring them here sometime in 2016.

    There appears to be no mention of the relative eligibility of Muslims and Christians – but of course that would be shockingly discriminatory.

    However, young, single men will be lowest on the eligibility list, which must make all decent, politically correct people feel very uncomfortable.

    Nonetheless, that cloud has a beautiful silver lining. Young single men need not all despair because there’s an exception for some of them.

    If a young, single man can produce convincing proof that he’s “gay” he will be moved nearer to the head of the queue.

    Isn’t it all an exquisitely refined example of liberalism?

  87. John birch@November 26th, 2015 – 05:34

    Good post.
    except Manningham is Bradford, not Leeds.

  89. Herbert Thornton
    November 26th, 2015 – 07:00
    What a pity that these young, single men don’t stay where they are and form an army to fight for their country. If I had my way, I’d give them all “discriminatory`’, I’d shoot the whole bloody lot if they came near these shores!

  90. People are saying we should train up all these migrant young men so they can return and fight for their countries.
    I’d be concerned about exactly who they would attack when trained, their own lot or us.

  92. Has Prime Minister Poodle, as I type being economical with the truth before the House of Commons, asked the government of Syria for an invitation to bomb its country or is that no longer a requirement where member states of the United Nations are concerned?

    The man’s casuistry is shameful, transparent.

  95. And Corbyn now bottles out of attacking ISIS as a cat’s paw of elements in “the West” or of denouncing a plan to destabilize Syria (and six other countries in the region) which has been in place since the 1990s.

    The mood of the House seemed to me to be markedly unenthusiastic. Let’s hope therefore that a majority of backbenchers will again refuse to be played for stooges.

  96. The Pennsylvania Avenue Caliphate has opined that Russia has concentrated its attacks exclusively on “moderate Syrian rebels”.

    Could one of our Russophobes clarify what Russian interest would be served in failing to bomb ISIS?

  97. Noa @ 21:49

    When things are happening, Noa, the barbarian’s too busy, whom shall he blame for it? There must a Government department, some outreachers around who could help Baron to come to terms with it.

    Still, here’s Baron shot at his MP, he decided to appeal to his sense as a human being wanting a career in politics,it’s short, in a Ladybird style, what else. He’ll let you know what the answer is.

    Soon, the House is going to vote on whether Britain should join other nations bombing in Syria. Whatever ‘cunning’ plan the PM may come up with, I very much hope you will oppose it, vote against our bombing in that already massively war-torn country, and not because of principle, like the Labour lot, but for purely pragmatic reasons.

    Britain hasn’t been invited by the Syrian Government to come and help, we cannot and should not fly over the country’s territory. It may seem a trivial matter given what Mr Cameroon thinks of Mr. Assad. The PM may have forgotten what Mr. Blair thought of Saddam Hussein when he decided Britain should join the US invading Iraq – and what an increasing number of people now think of the former PM, what the future could still bring. You should not be a member of a similar club.

    Our joining the other countries hitting the ISIL thugs will change the balance of power so marginally as to be almost laughable, we do not have enough military gear to make a serious contribution. More to the point, as you well know what’s needed is not airpower, but boots on the ground. We don’t have them, and even if we did have enough infantry it would be suicidal to deploy them there. It may seem an un-PC thing to say, but the only ground forces that could be acceptable, cause less of a reaction in boosting jihadism, would be those of the same religious family, i.e. Muslim fighters.

    The key question to ask about our involvement is this: Will the outcome of our joining the fray outweigh the risk of an atrocity on our soil, atrocity similar to that on the Friday 13th in Paris? Only someone whose brainless, or cares not about this country could answer it in the affirmative. However good our Secret Services are, one of two jihadis may slip through, tens if not hundreds may perish. If that were to happen, the great unwashed will unquestionably link the two, and any MP who backed the PM to go demolish more of Syria will also be marked with the dire consequences of it.

    It may seem secondary to mention it, Mr. Cartlidge, but it should be of some importance to you. If you want to make a career in politics it never fails to take a small step back or sideways to make a big one forward later. You’ve joined the political ranks only recently, have done very well so fare.g. the railways issue.

    What is it that drives the PM is impossible to say, who can look into a men’s soul, but it can hardly be a rational take on the Syrian conflict. There is no reason to back him on it. Similarly to what happened to those who backed Tony Blair, you may one day regret it. It ain’t worth it.

    Please, think hard before you vote, and do vote against our going to bomb Syria.

    bla bla

  98. Radford NG @ 06:30

    The laugh came so handy, Radford, thank you. It will be after a long no-buy policy on the rag, Baron’s going to purchases this copy.

  99. John birch @ 05:34

    Good one again from Liddle, John, he’s one of the few who fears not to put his head above the PC line that much more than the others. But then, whether the others are journalists is more than questionable.

  100. Frank P @ 01:39

    What are you up to, Frank. For days you hibernate, not a word from you, deadly silence, Baron’s beginning to worry you sneaked out to Syria to have a look, then bang, you’re back on the blog setting tasks for the crew.

    Look, who knows what the future brings, ‘predict, man, everything, but …you remember?

    In one respect the omni-all Mr. Boot’s wrong, and it may be the ‘respect’ that cuts it. Way back in 1914 nuclear weaponry didn’t exist, they didn’t even suspect it can exist. They got closest with gas, but used it sparingly exactly for the same drawback the nuclear threat has, it kills indiscriminately, differentiate not between friend and foe.

    Would any of the world leaders risk pushing the button? Baron will repeat himself again here (he does that ofter for lack of new ideas), no, they will not. To rule over a world in which half of us are dead, the other hand dying? A dirty bomb, if the religiously motivated nutters get hold of few grams of the stuff, is more likely.

    This doesn’t rule out big regional proxy fighting, the ME has been it for some time, the likes of Hamas or whatever are but the pawns of the big regional, world players. Syria may be the latest battlefield for the two superpower rivals to test their conventional toys one on one, see how well the toys kill.

    Btw, when the Turks downed the bomber they called NATO immediately. Baron hears it was because they got scared Russia will hit them in Turkey, wanted reassurances NATO will invoke clause 4&5 of the Treaty. Allegedly, NATO told them to go jump the tree.

    So much so for treaties under the US umbrella, ha?

    And another thing on Mr. Boot’s slicing of the loss of the Russian jet. Towards the end of the rant he says something like the Turks will be only to happy to pull the trigger when Russian jets get into their air space – “especially when these planes are bombing Turkmen villages inhabited by the Turks’ ethnic brothers”. Funny, he seems to approve of the Turks hitting an enemy of their ethnic brothers, but denies the same right for Russia helping not ‘ethnic brothers’, but genuine Russians in Ukraine.The man’s a po-faced hypocrite.

  102. For the footballing connoisseurs only?:

    As if he didn’t have enough on his plate (allegation of sex with a minor, not charged; driving his Buggati without proper papers, alleged extortion of another player), the French international Karim Benzema spat on the field after a version of the Marseillaise finished playing before a match between Real Madrid and Barca.

    Can someone ask the boy, or the French top guy if Benzema is one of the good Muslims anyone can trust?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_TyVturXaU

  103. Baron
    November 26th, 2015 – 13:14

    I think you are right to negate Mr Boot’s pessimism. It equates with the Slavic temperament (po-faced hypocrite-may be a bit strong)

    Mr Boot says “This is the perennial aim of Russia’s policy towards Turkey, which can only be achieved by turning the country into a Russian dominion.”

    This is naïve oversimplification

    You have to ask
    What is Russia’s endgame at this time
    Putin has a clear view of Russia’s best interests (as shown in Crimea and East Ukraine)
    Just at present it is delivery of a Syrian client state to protect his base on the Mediterranean

    What best to do to achieve this
    Well in fact he needs to keep the US on side
    And so he will use the Turkish shoot down to manipulate Obama to go along with his support of Assad “as an interim measure” to produce military stability across Iraq

    In this way he sees that events are converging to his endgame

    Hollande is dragging us all kicking and screaming to stop the civil war in Syria by making the crushing of ISIS paramount above all other considerations

    This suits Putin best and will deliver a Syrian client state that he and Tehran can control

  105. Would the Brits, the frogs, the Ruskies or the Yanks ever use the bomb? I seriously doubt it. The Chinese? possibly. The Pakis or the Indians? definitely. The hatred between those two counties is visceral, that is where the balloon will go up. This is not conjecture on my part, I have lived there and been in the room when such matters have been discussed, the hatred of the one for the other is frightening. Oh, and while I am on the subject they all blame their problems on Mountbatten.

  106. Stephen 15.26
    I absolutely agree. I was never worried in the Cold War days, when you are up against sensible thinking people you have a way of assuming what they think.
    I was always concerned about Arabs because they have a problem thinking sensibly and logically. In all their countries the obvious is not obvious at all.
    Their brains are obsessed with hatred of Jews, Islam , praying, tribal issues, denying they had anything to do with what they were doing yesterday that is near impossible to deal with them.
    This (and their idleness) is why they can do nothing without the wests assistance.
    Look at Isis, take their western inventions away and their back sitting in the sand dunes hating their neighbors.
    They hate us because they know how useless they really are.

  108. John birch – 16:20

    I have put their extreme malaise down to them having to learn reams of prose without applying it or testing its veracity; it stunts their imagination and therefore their reasoning capacity. I don’t think it really matters what it is they are learning, though remembering and being able to recite inhuman and illogical rubbish doesn’t help the situation.

    Even if the passages that are memorised are ‘normal’ for film dialogue, it can still produce the sort of outbursts from actors, singers and celebrities that the BBC promote and the Left adore!

  109. telemachus @ 15:10

    Point taken, calling the omni-all po-faced hypocrite was going too far, telemachus, will an apology here do for someone who doesn’t read this blog?

    Still, Baron’s rather disappointed with the KGB Colonel reaction to the downing of the plane. Apparently, he’s asked Medvedev, the PM, to prepare a list of economic sanctions. That’s wrong, it will hurt ordinary Turks, they are not Vlad’s adversaries.

    The response is emotion driven. He should have though about it, stay cool, then supply the Syrian Kurds with truck based surface to air missiles, much better, out of the Russsi-NATO domain.

  110. stephen maybery @ 15:26

    India may care less about radioactive Pakistan, but could they ensure the radioactivity from their pummelling its neighbour doesn’t hit India, too. Would they really take the risk? Because if it did, the Indian unwashed will revolt more against their own than the enemy, no?

    What you reckon, my blogging friend?

  111. John birch @ 17:11

    Not the only paradox of the standoff.

    Russia is supplying the Americans with trucks, earthmoving gear, food in Afghanistan. In January, she also signed a billion dollar contract to furnish the Americans with rocket engine(s) even though sanctions apply. Go figure.

  112. John birch – 17:11

    I imaging not as well as China and France’s efforts at Hinkley C; though give it time and you never know …..

    I picture a cartoon, with one turkey saying to the other, “The bad news is that the power station won’t be finished until after Christmas”. 🙂

  113. Baron,
    We can and would look at a situation calmly and dispassionately, evaluating the consequences of any action. The peoples of the East are governed by emotion, not a sound basis for rational action, they squawk first and and think after, frequently long after. I may sound a cynical sod but I have seen too much of the world to be under any illusions regarding many of it’s inhabitants.

  114. Corbyn believes that this country would be made more vulnerable to terrorist attacks if Britain attacked Syria by air. In my opinion, this country would be better served by stopping all so-called refugees and migrants entering this realm. Anyone ignoring this directive should be instantly eliminated without question. One can imagine the horror such a scenario would be for ‘humanists ‘such as Corbyn and his ilk.

  115. This runs and runs, a repetition in motion, but you get the idea soon. It comes from one of Baron’s friends over in the Republic:

    President Assad (who is bad) is a nasty guy who got so nasty his people rebelled and the Rebels (who are good) started winning (hurrah!).

    But then some of the rebels turned a bit nasty and are now called Islamic State ( who are definitely bad!) and some continued to support democracy (who are still good.)

    So the Americans ( who are good ) started bombing Islamic State (who are bad) and giving arms to the Syrian Rebels (who are good) so they could fight Assad (who is still bad) which was good.

    By the way, there is a breakaway state in the north run by the Kurds who want to fight ISIS (which is a good thing) but the Turkish authorities think they are bad, so we have to say they are bad whilst secretly thinking they’re good and giving them guns to fight ISIS (which is good) but that is another matter.

    Getting back to Syria.

    So President Putin (who is bad, cos he invaded Crimea and the Ukraine and killed lots of folks including that nice Russian man in London with polonium has decided to back Assad (who is still bad) by attacking ISIS (who are also bad) which is sort of a good thing.

    But Putin (still bad) thinks the Syrian Rebels (who are good) are also bad, and so he bombs them too, much to the annoyance of the Americans (who are good) who are busy backing and arming the rebels (who are also good).

    Now Iran (who used to be bad, but ssince they have agreed not to build any nuclear weapons and bomb Israel are now good) are going to provide ground troops to support Assad (still bad) as are the Russians (bad) who now have ground troops and aircraft in Syria.

    So a Coalition of Assad (still bad) Putin (extra bad) and the Iranians (good, but in a bad sort of way) are going to attack ISIS (who are bad) which is a good thing, but also the Syrian Rebels (who are good) which is bad.

    Now the British (obviously good, except that nice Mr Corbyn in the corduroy jacket, who is probably bad ) and the Americans (also good) cannot attack Assad (still bad) for fear of upsetting Putin (bad) and Iran (good/bad) and now they have to accept that Assad might not be that bad after all compared to ISIS (who are super bad).

    So Assad (bad) is now probably good, being better than ISIS (but let’s face it, drinking your own wee is better than ISIS so no real choice there) and since Putin and Iran are also fighting ISIS that may now make them good. America ( still good ) will find it hard to arm a group of rebels being attacked by the Russians for fear of upsetting Mr Putin (now good) and that nice mad Ayatollah in Iran (also good) so they may be forced to say that the Rebels are now bad, or at the very least abandon them to their fate. This will lead most of them to flee to Turkey and on to Europe or join ISIS (still the only constantly bad group).

    To Sunni Muslims, an attack by Shia Muslims (Assad and Iran) backed by Russians will be seen as something of a Holy War, and the ranks of ISIS will now be seen by the Sunnis as the only Jihadis fighting in the Holy War and hence many Muslims will now see ISIS as Good (Doh!.)

    Sunni Muslims will also see the lack of action by Britain and America in support of their Sunni rebel brothers as something of a betrayal (might have a point.) and hence we will be seen as Bad.

    So now we have America (now bad) and Britain (also bad) providing limited support to Sunni Rebels ( bad ) many of whom are looking to ISIS (Good/bad ) for support against Assad (now good) who, along with Iran (also good) and Putin (also, now, unbelievably, good) are attempting to retake the country Assad used to run before all this started?

    I hope that clears up all that confusion for you! 

  117. Has anyone been missing the Colonel? Baron has, together with the guru he formed the twin pillars of our society of world governance in retirement, the rest of us serving the drinks.

    Baron had a friend who used to say ‘if only barbers and taxi drivers could run things all would be well’. He’s no longer with us, Baron often wonders what would he say reading the blogs. Probably, ‘amazing how many barbers and taxi drivers there are’.

  119. Baron
    November 26th, 2015 – 19:40

    Indeed, Indeed
    But we can look back on brilliant posts

    “The unwritten British constitution is an untidy thing, more cobbled together as a shanty town than as a perfectly designed skyscraper. It has got by, surprisingly successfully, and until about 1963 its apparent chaos and inconsistencies were seen as much a strength as a weakness. But Mr Cameron’s generation of young career politicians share their arrogance with the relentless rise of wonkery; the promotion of theoretical excellence by people who make a living from its arcane manipulation of words and its presumption of infallible certainties. It might be no coincidence that those teaching the creed and those learning it rarely represent any endeavour outside it. But more surprising is the way that it has also managed to usurp the language and strategies of almost every practical endeavour in this country, from the board room to the hospital ward, from the call centre to the barracks. Wonks and their close cousins accountants now pretty much reign throughout our society. How it came to be that boring bean counters became synonymous with strategic management, power and leadership is something of a puzzle to me but the effects are plain to see in the chaos surrounding banking, for example, and the growth of corporate feudalism. The idea that the wonderful richness and interplay of human beings actually deciding things case by case according to context, experience and circumstances could be improved upon and measured by spreadsheets, targets and tick boxes never convinced this conservative but it did create whole tiers of ambitious management and aggressive careers, many of which have become exceedingly lucrative for those involved in promoting them. The poor old man in the street has never been so put upon or stitched up like a kipper by the unholy alliance between political robber barons on the one hand and corporate robber barons on the other, both of whom now tyrannise with the spreadsheet, the targets and the tick boxes fed into the oracle of the computer.”

  120. telemachus @ 20:41

    Brilliant is the right adjective to label it with, telemachus, but we no longer have the pleasure and privilege to have the next instalments.

  123. Noa @ 21:26

    Thank you for the link, Noa, the most enjoyable, informative, thought provoking 90 minutes for a long time.

    It’s not often Baron finds himself with such full agreement with anyone as he does with Peter Hitchens on this topic. The only area of slight variance may be his take on the possible ‘merger’ of the German and Russian tribes. He hinted at it, didn’t enlarge on it. The barbarian reckons it’s almost a destiny of the Old Continent that the two great powers will combine at some juncture in the future, what the late Tzars, Kaisers nibbled at, future leaders of Russia and Germany will put together.

  124. The recent protracted absence of the tellyturd caused me to hope that Peter had confined the troll to the oubliette and had Informed Colonel Mustard that he had done so and that we therefore enjoy CM’s contributions to CHW once again.

    What I didn’t anticipate was that the turd troll would not only reappear, but would have the fucking gall to weasel his way back in via the device of trying to curry favour here by quoting one of CM’s previous posts. The phrase ‘po-faced hypocrite’ was used earlier on this thread about someone else. Undeservedly so imho. Be that as it may, Baron has earned the right to say what he likes without incurring my insignificant wrath, as he’s well in credit, polemically speaking, hereupon; though I’m disappointed that he engaged with the dog-turd without pointing out HIS hypocrisy.

    By the same token, please allow me attempt to express my contempt for the interloper. He’s a jumped up, scaly-backed, two-faced hypocritical, mendacious little arse-licking toe-rag – and an agitprop toady, to boot (pun intended).

    I, like the Colonel, am tired of ploughing through this park’s dog-shit, much as I enjoy the company of fellow strollers whose conversation I have enjoyed in some cases for well over a decade. I could do without daily encountering a ‘fellow traveller’, life’s too short – for me anyway. His presence devalues the blog, both as a meeting place of right thinking coves and as a glossary of great links, with a strain of bawdy banter in its presentation to lighten the gloom of the geopolitical chaos. I move that steps are taken to remove the canker once and for all and that mine host invites the Colonel to return with his excellent analyses forthwith. The smug gloating of the douchebag is the last straw. Free speech is one thing, Commie propaganda by the shitload is another. Beyond the pale. Off with his head!

  125. Frank 00.39

    I scroll right past the troll, just like I hit the mute button when Obama is spouting his lies, and my blood pressure is just fine !

  126. postergal (01:51)

    We’ve tried that. For yonks. He sticks. Like toilet paper to an old man’s shoe. It’s time to remove the distraction from the flow. His return was to gloat over what he sees as an achievement – the absence of his stalking target . Why grant him even that deluded pleasure? Pretty please, Peter. Sort him.

  128. postergirl
    November 27th, 2015 – 01:51
    Frank 00.39
    Wise advice Gal, that’s exactly what I have done for years.
    postergirl
    Frank P
    November 27th, 2015 – 02:16
    Frank, I love you but you will hate what I am going to say now. I think that if Peter removed this scum you would miss it. Rather like a sore tooth that one keeps touching with one’s tongue. IGNORE HIM, if he gets no feed back he will eventually piss off, stephen maybery and postergirl have the right approach,

  129. Anne,

    No Anne, you can’t ignore an interloper. That’s not how agitprop works; not just a toothache, he’s a pain in the arse. He, like Jermy

  130. Corbollux never give up. They eat into the social structure like termites. They first weaken, then destroy, then feed off the gunge that’s left like writhing maggots. It is a shame that the Colonel decided to leave us. I know that some think he threw in the towel; I don’t. I can understand why he won’t subject himself to that sort of nuisance. If you are are sharing space with someone who craps on the carpet daily, you either eject him or leave yourself. You don’t pretend that the turd and its stench is not there. THAT way the turd wins. Peter is the landlord, only he can eject him. In my opinion the time has come. Then we can resume the flow. He’s no longer grist to the mill, he’s grit in the eye. Let’s have a vote. I’ve just registered mine – obviously. Please, as with the EU, this time it’s the PWEEUH! Vote OUT!

  131. It’s bad enough being presented with sneering faces of Flabbot, Corbynski, O’Donnell, Livingstone et al, and their constant treasonous verbiage, every time you plug into any element of the MSM, we need a Marx free space in which to commune.

  132. This is how they learn:

    In 2003, Blair wanted to hit Iraq, argued the country has WMD. We went in, found none, but alot of hate and improvised explosive devices. We lost treasure, and above all the lives of 179 young boys and girls, many more wounded. Iraq’s not less of a shithole it was before the invasion.

    Today, the H2B wants to hit Syria, believes the country has 70,000 civilised, anti-Assad warriors waiting just for us. We will go in, find no such fighters, lose treasure …, the religion infested thugs meantime arrange for a repeat of Friday13th in London.

    Why do people vote for the wankers?

  133. And my last word on the subject, Anne, I promise. You hit a nerve with the sore tooth analogy: are you plugged into my tablet camera, by any chance? That’s exactly what I’ve been doing, tongueing a tatty tooth. I’ve booked an appointment with dentist – if you get my drift!

  134. I look upon here as a refuge from the other place, a private place open to all newcomers that avoid the behaviour that was witnessed at the other place, so I am all for calling in the pest controller.

    It is the equivalent of talking loudly in a library, when there isn’t any reason to, like a fire!

  135. Child sex abuse inquiry to focus on churches and politicians
    Goddard says her independent inquiry will look at allegations against current and former MPs and claims of cover-up
    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/nov/27/child-sex-abuse-inquiry-to-focus-on-churches-and-politicians

    And then do what: really get down to business or will it be a case of ‘Move along there, nothing to see’?

    Wouldn’t it be better to, initially, follow the trails to assess the situation, and then decide strategy, probably geographically, area by area, no matter which ‘community’ it involves?

  136. Baron – 11:44

    I heard, on good authority, that there were WMD in Iraq, right up to the moment when war was declared, with a report about it by an American based reporter ‘disappearing’ when it reached his paper’s HQ, in New York / Washington. The offending equipment was moved out of the country just in time, so when the war started, there were none left!

    It doesn’t mean that going to war was right on that occasion.

    I can see why Tory MPs want to bomb Syria: standing side by side with Hollande, pretence that it matters (as we could bomb Iraq a little more so the US could redeploy planes to Syrian targets), CMD’s ego, or just because of Corbyn’s stance, but it still doesn’t make it right.

    It needs a plan, starting with more financial measures, charity status review of suspect organisations and more extremists being removed from areas of influence, but the ‘uman right lawyers will put a stop to that!

  137. Baron (11:44)

    While I agree that bombing alone is basically bullshit and could even be counter-productive; I demur on the general thesis (accepting that the ‘general thesis’ is not necessarily yours) that doing nothing and letting the Near East stew in its own juice is the alternative. The spearhead of the jihad is now the ever increasing band of nutters who call themselves the New Caliphate. The Muslim Bros and their Gramsci-like project benefit from the chaos that IS is causing in the Theatre, even though they are not in lockstep.

    Waiting for Vlad to bring order there is not my idea of a solution particularly if he does it in conjunction with the mullah’s in Tehran. From a Slavic viewpoint that may be preferable to a replenished American hegemony, if a bullish new POTUS is elected next year.

    My Western hackles rise at the thought of Mother Russia and Persia taking control of the Great Global Game. Less so in your case?

    We agree on what the solution is not. What’s your strategy for bringing about the right solution?

  138. Can I recommend the December issue of Modern Railways as an instruction manual on why not nationalise anything
    The UK rail infrastructure company, Network Rail, is publicly owned. The not for profit model used by Byers was bollocks. it was always public.
    BR electrified the East Coast line very efficiently. OK some bits are not as robust as they could be because of cost cutting but it works most of the time.
    Notwork rail are electrifying the Great western line. It will be very late so we will have new and very expensive (twice the cost of pendolinos as used out of Euston) unable to be used. Or struggling on under their small diesel plant which was specified for diversions or short extensions beyond the wires, not thrashing along at 125mph.
    But the electrification cost is out of control. Originally priced at £625m in July 2009, now priced at £2915m. That, compared on a £ per track mile basis with the ECML, and adjusted for inflation, is 6.6 times more expensive.
    The PAC had a go at ORR and network rail about this , saying ‘why didn’t you tell us it will be so expensive. But they didnt ask, ‘why is it so expensive’ So no plaudits for the PAC
    but massive raspberries for Notwork Rail and ORR.

    if this were private, then people would have lost their jobs. but no clear out of the useless top management of ORR and NR

    This is NR that have massively delayed trans penning and midland electrification. And dont seem to be able to electrify the short bit between Walsall and rugely in under 2 years.

    and in 2020 a lot of trains will be illegal cos of new disability regs. so the whole thing could fall apart. ROSCOS wont buy diesels because of long term uncertainty about use of diesel trains.

  140. Frank P
    November 27th, 2015 – 11:52
    And my last word on the subject, Anne, I promise. You hit a nerve with the sore tooth analogy: are you plugged into my tablet camera, by any chance? That’s exactly what I’ve been doing, tongueing a tatty tooth. I’ve booked an appointment with dentist – if you get my drift!

    Frank, I am psychic – drill,drill, grrrr! grrrr! 🙁

  141. Frank P 00.35

    Seconded, thirded and forthed Frank. the unctuous telly turd should be the subject of a total and permanent exclusion order.
    In fact I will contribute to Peter’s CHW on the day Peter advises of this.

  142. Alexsandr At 13:14

    The old GWR main line should be at a huge advantage to other lines when putting the 25kV overhead cables through tunnels. The legacy of Brunel’s broad gauge has provided huge headroom. Not like on the Midland main line!

  143. Baron,

    An interesting thought that; eventual union between the Teutons and the Slavs. I can’t see it myself. The point of Peter Hitchens’ lecture was surely that where the tectonic plates clash, the cultural fault line, is Ukraine, rich in natural assets. Can Russia and Germany share it?
    Surely the memories of Tannenburg, Brest-Litovsk and Operation Barbarossa, with over 20 million WW2 Russian dead alone, will not fade for centuries?
    But the deciding factor may well be the Islamisation of Germany. By 2020 there will be as many male ‘German’ muslims as indigenous men of military age. Do you think Russia will succumb to a Caliphate from the West?

  144. On the value of bombing somebody in Syria, Mr Farage has it about right I think.

    In fact I would go so far as to speculate that better results in reducing terrorist jihadism would be achieved by bombing the appeasers residing in Downing St and Westminster than down town Aleppo or Damascus. It might develop an empathy with the now-obliterated Syrian Christian and Yazidi communities and encourage them to address the issues arising from the agitated practitioners of ROP, both home and abroad.

    http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/11/27/farage-for-breitbart-the-plan-to-bomb-syria-may-be-yet-another-thoughtless-intervention/

  145. Alexsandr and Chris Morriss

    Network Rail apparently purchased a vastly expensive piece of mobile plant to go along the tracks at night putting in posts and stringing wires from them……and it does not work;because they failed to take into account what-ever items it was.

  146. Rdford.

    They kept driving piles through signalling cables.

    they also didnt realise that when brunel built embankments he used the material from cuttings. Now some of that material was socking great boulders. Hit one of those with a pile and the pile stops there. no further.

    There is also gold plating of the scheme to conform to Eu interoperability rules. They could have got a derrogation but didnt. So more bridges have needed rebuiulding than necessary
    (Eu wanted the overhead to be 140mph capable. The IEP is planned to run at 125
    Now the height of the overhead changes as it goes high for crossings and low for bridges. Now the pan on the train can only change height up to a certain speed. The faster you go for a certain wire gradient the faster the pan changes height. So stuff had to be done to keep the wire gradient suitable for 140mph which is faster then the speed the trains will go)

    Also DfT has specified 5 car bi-mode trains. so for a busy service you run 2 in multiple. But that means 2 pans up. the 2nd pan on the train runs into the interference in the wire and the air and thus has poor current collection. so the overhead design needs to be beefed up. adding costs. Pendos on the west coast are 11 long and 1 pan so no problem.

    (Pan = pantograph, the thing on top of the train that gets power from the overhead)

  147. I can’t be alone in thinking that Hollande is milking the Paris atrocities to the last curdled drop? How many more ‘national days of mourning’ with the midget shitbag strutting across cobbled Places de le Bollieux, with brass bands playing ‘La Marseillaise’ as though the frogs had secured some grand victory, rather than witnessing an abysmal failure in policy, security and political nous. He’s a womanising posturing little commie with a Napoleonic complex. Grand parades should be saved for celebrating victory and remembering the dead killed in battle whilst securing it. Not to mark failure of government failure on the grand scale and resultant loss of innocent civilian life in their capital city. What a wanquer! All the pomp & circumstance is about him. Even the relatives of the dead are pissed off with it reportedly. And our bent meeja are covering it because it gives further oxygen to the ‘climate change’ change piss-take and piss-up. And now Wankers Moon, the Sec. Gen. of the most corrupt and useless rig-up in the history of international boondogglery is jumping on the band wagon of the gravy train. It would be the height of irony of the jihadists could pull off of biggie as the World’s political jerk-offs foregathered. Here’s one who wouldn’t mourn a one of ’em! No orchids for Mr. Blandishment from me!

  149. Frank P
    November 27th, 2015 – 17:37
    Agree! But that’s frogs for you. Remember De Gaulle? Hardly a midget in height or ego. He sat out World War II as the Head of the Government in Exile, and afterwards thanked Britain for food and board by continually being a thorn in our sides.

  150. Frank P
    November 27th, 2015 – 17:37
    Frank, Agree! But that’s frogs for you. Remember De Gaulle? Hardly a midget in height or ego. He sat out World War II as the Head of the Government in Exile, and afterwards thanked Britain for food and board by continually being a thorn in our sides.

  155. Is ISIS a threat to western existence?

    “…Once upon a time, to be “Western” implied a commitment to transcendent values. For those who have remained loyal to Christianity and Judaism, it meant faith in their religious values and democracy and freedom. For the Enlightenment legatees of that tradition, it meant just democracy and freedom. But for both it meant a commitment to defend and die for a cause bigger than the self….”

    What will fill the vacuum?

    http://www.quadrapheme.com/is-isis-an-existential-threat/

  157. Noa
    November 27th, 2015 – 19:05
    Is ISIS a threat to western existence?
    I fear I have quoted it before, but W.B. Yeats exactly pictured what is happening in “The Second Coming”.
    The Second Coming – Poetry Foundation
    http://www.poetryfoundation.org › Poems & Poets
    Surely the Second Coming is at hand. … And what rough beast, its hour come round at last, Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

  160. Hi Anne,
    It’s nice to see you back. I must go to Israel… it’s on my trug list (I’m too bloody minded to have a ‘bucket list’-that’s just walking unevenly!

    That’s perhaps the point of Michael Cook’s article, to which I was referring. He forecasts that the present Western vacuum of faith will be filled.
    By what remains to be seen.

  161. Good news;or bad news?

    Baroness (Patricia) Scotland (New Labour) appointed Secretary General Of The Commonwealth.
    One thing against her is that she is a co-President of Chatham House….the Establishment,pro-EU,think tank.

    http://www.patriciascotland.com

  162. Noa
    November 27th, 2015 – 19:48
    Hi Noa,
    It’s good to read yout postings once again. Really CHW is something very special in this world where so many seem to have lost the way.

  163. Noa @ 19:05

    Good link, Noa.

    The comparison with WW2 doesn’t fit exactly, Noa. Nazism, as an evil ideology we had to defeat to breathe freely again, was linked to essentially one country, Germany, and few German minorities in the countries surrounding her. Everyone knew it, it was transparently obvious, the political classes, the MSM, the unwashed didn’t live in denial of it (even though many outside Germany were hoping to appease it before it got going in earnest).

    The ideology we are fighting today is also coupled with a single country, but it isn’t ISIL, but Saudi Arabia. But here comes the difference. Not many in any strata of our society would admit to it, (Peter H, the great Mark are amongst the rare exceptions to it), nobody dares bringing up the role of the Saudis in this ‘existential’ crisis, nobody even questions why they don’t help either by taking some of the refugees, furnishing money to Arab countries that do.

    If, by a miracle, the evil kingdom were to disappear tomorrow, ISIL, other jihadi groups, any active or sleeping cells in the West would not survive the Winter, they would starve of resources, fragment, vanish. If they didn’t, it would that much easier to locate, liquidate them without the Saudi’s backing. Some remnants of them may still shout, but they would be cut off from the key source of their funding, support, both material and ideological.

    Ask yourself. If we were to break up the ISIL stronghold in Syria, would jihadism disappear, evaporate, vanish into thin air? Of course not. We’ve pushed Al-Queda from Afghanistan, they’re elsewhere including Syria, as are other groups funded directly or indirectly from the Saudi coffers.

    The grand coalition Hollande is trying to put together is but a desperate attempt by him to save his presidency, he had months to beef up security after the Charlie atrocities, he failed, when the post mortem gets going, the French will dispose of him.

  164. Frank P @ 18:37

    No point to dissect this piece, Frank, except for this.

    The Russians had been importing annually $60bn worth of agricultural produce, you name it, they were bringing it in – cheese, bacon, other meat product, apples, other fruits, fish, vegetables, brandy, wine ….

    Why TF should a country of the size of Russia be importing so much of what they can produce easily themselves, (and if anything export some of it, too)?

    The crisis should, and hopefully will be, the epiphany for their blindness. They either go for import substitution, or they starve. It’s one or the other. If they cannot go for the former, let it be the latter, they would deserve it.

  165. Frank P @ 13:00

    Just one point, Frank. Winston made a deal with the most murderous thug the world had known then, the Georgian tyrant, to defeat a greater evil. However bad Assad was or still is, the proxy of the Saudi Wahhabism, ISIL, is unquestionably a greater evil still.

    You are worried that Russia cum Iran will form a military duet, take over the world?

    Come on, Frank, get real, it’s by far more probable that Wahhabism will be the new hegemonic ideology, no?

  166. There are only two sides in the Syrian conflict: Assad and his forces, and the groups (including ISIL) fighting him. That’s it. The ranting about good opposition, bad opposition forces or whatever is just that, a rant to confuse things.

    Those armed men opposing Assad are by and large mercenaries, they fight for money, not for anything else, their ideology derives from their own interpretation of the Koran, (everyone fighting there is a follow er of Allah), whoever pays more gets their transient loyalty. Those trained by the Americans who deserted immediately after moving to the battlefield did so because ISIL, flush with money from oil sales, direct funding from the Saudis, Qatar, bribed them. If we go in, pay more than ISIL many will switch allegiance, the question is will ISIL, some other backers offer more still?

    The only groups that are harder to bribe with money are the Kurds, the Turkmen. How good they are could be judged by the fighters from the latter group killing the parachuted Russian pilot.

  167. And since you ask, Frank.

    If Baron were in charge here, he would put in place a five point strategy:

    Stop all immigration from Muslim countries except for 100% genuine cases of asylum seekers.

    Deport immediately everyone breaking the law as it stands, not just the culprit, the family, too, only one appeal allowed.

    Set up a system for establishing the loyalty to the Crown (you recall the two questions those suspecting of disloyalty would have to answer? (Baron has no time to even re-type them).

    Withdraw our military from the ME, fully.

    Suspend arms sales to Saudi Arabia, other Gulf states (flog it to the Chinese, Ruskies if need be), expel all preachers funded by the countries involved, cut off any religious financing from them, set up a special force to track any on-line recruiters, shut them down, deport them if they refused to stop.

    That would do for a start.

  169. Baron at 20-58

    This was understood in 1917.After the Arabs took Akaba Lt.Col.T.E.Lawrence set of across Sinai to Cairo to get ships to take away the Turks and gold to keep the Arab tribesmen from going home.
    Take no notice of David Lean’s movie which has Lawrence leading a charge across a waterless desert to Akaba (the Arab rebels were in the mountains above Akaba;the nearest Lawrence came to death was when he and his camel were caught-out alone one night in a snow storm):nor heed the scene of him crossing Sinai with a 12 year old boy who was denied entry to a racist Cairo hotel.He was with a party of men who went of to the camel camp…..leaving Lawrence marooned in the eastern half of the British Empire,unable to cross the Canal to the western half.

    After fruitless calls to the Canal Authority he heard from the telephone exchange the voice of a Northumberland Fusilier:”It’s no use you bothering with them buggers,sir,they’ill not help you”. He is put on to the Harbour Master at Port Suez who sends a launch into the sacred waters of the Canal to pick him up.

    At the nearest railway station he (in full Arab dress) comes upon the top British commanding officers and announces the capture.[All this is one of the funniest parts of `The Seven Pillars of Wisdom`.]……David Lean,with his own agenda,has Lawrence announce this at a staff meeting and all the officers chuffing that it was impossible.

    T.E.Lawrence’s `Seven Pillars of Wisdom`is a good read and explains much of the Arab world.

  170. Baron,
    Once more your fiddle is pitch perfect and you play it beautifully. No one who has any experience of the Middle East is in any doubt as to the culpability of the al Saud in the funding and propagationof the terrorism directed at us. And unless we are prepared to hit them with terminal velocity and expel their adherents from our midst then it will only be matter of time before we are all head down with arse in the air in the direction of Mecca.

  171. What do you do when you capture a great Arab city? We also find this from Lawrence.

    After taking Damascus,Feisal orders all public servants to remain at their posts.He is particularly concerned to keep the power-station operating to keep the street lights on to prevent disorder.

    Lawrence tells of coming down next morning and standing on the hotel steps watching the electric tram trundle along the street.

    The ineffable David Lean has the racist British officers demanding that Feisal surrender Damascus to them or they will remove the British officers from the power station and leave the city,and the hospital,without a water supply!

    Lean offended the Arabs right at the begining with the famous scene of Omar Shrieff riding out of the heat haze and shooting dead Lawrence’s guide for drinking from `his`well.”What kind of people does he think we are”:they demanded.

    So,Lean depicts the British officers as racists,and the Arabs as ignorant savages.

  172. Lawrence also records that under the Hashimite Sheriff (?) of Mecca,and in accordance with tribal custom, passionate relationships occurred between young men on the hot desert sands,under the dark night sky;until they married and got over it.

    And if any woman dressed as a man,and rode and fought alongside the men,she was accepted as an equal;and was even allowed to take a `wife`.

    This was the way of the Meccan tribes before ibn Saud took power in 1922.

  173. Forgive me interrupting your historical and fictional/factional musing, but this should interest our Baronial pal, given his father’s erstwhile occupation. Seems Baron’s compatriot lorry driver has some cojones, which is more than I can say for the alakific Frog coppers, who failed to provide any support in his time of need:

    http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/11/27/video-ill-kill-ccksucker-hungarian-lorry-driver-swerves-hit-migrants-warzone-calais/

  176. The two reports above belie the sentimental gush from the frogs – and the timing of the ‘climate change’ junket. The police guarding the bullshitting parasites at that gathering would be better employed suppressing the Muzzie invaders. WTF?? How long before cross-channel commerce is brought to a complete standstill. Somebody should take Corbynski to le continent and throw the fucker into a transport caff to preach his fucking pacifism! Making sure first that the Hungarian trucker has had a few jars beforehand.

  177. Dunno what the stand-off in Colorado is about yet, but it looks as though the rednecks are beginning to crack under the strain and take the law into their own hands: first target Planned Parenthood. Either that or his girlfriend/wife has had a d & c against his wishes and he’s decided to wipe out the perpetrators. We shall see. Four cops injured so far. Chaos everywhere.

  178. Pity Shep Smith is on leave, the Thanksgiving weekend staff are amateurs by comparison and the on-the-spot reporters are waffling. Whatever the shooter’s motives, looks like he’ll come out, eventually, in a body bag. He has IEDs, too. Don’t think he’s a Muzzie.

  183. That’s the wild West for you, Frank, today.

    Amazingly, very few people got shot in the wild West in the wild days of the migration west. Truly just a few, a dozen or so, the myth that it was the time of the lawless, the thuggish, the one with the gun always wins is just that, a myth.

    It seems that America would have done better to stay ‘barbaric’ rather than embrace decadence.

  185. The World, or the EU bit of it, has gone bonkers, even more than it had yesterday!

    EU and Labour MEPs say we MUST welcome back jihadis because border controls are RACIST
    ISLAMIC State (ISIS) jihadis have been given carte blanche to reach the gates of Britain and potentially carry out atrocities against innocent civilians after an EU motion backed by Labour BANNED using border controls to stop terrorism.
    “Labour MEPs voted en masse for a raft of Brussels resolutions which will prevent European security services in Schengen agreement countries from implementing “any border control measures aimed at fighting terrorism”.

    The barmy edicts claim that trying to stop terrorists from returning home is racist and set out a series of stringent criteria dictating how extremists’ “human rights” must be pandered to.”

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/622567/Eu-Labour-let-jihadists-back-to-UK-racist-not-to

    Corbyn has more supporters than the PLP thought he had! 🙂

    With politicians like this, why bother with law enforcement?

    To keep us under control: that’s what!

  186. Frank P @ 23:18

    Close, Frank, Hungary’s next door to the land of the Czechs.

    This is what happens when those in charge do FA to solve a problem and, Baron’s sorry to say it, the reaction of the driver’s wrong. He should get angry at the lawmakers of Europe, it’s they who created the conditions he has found himself in.

    If Europe emulated the approach of the Australians, rather than the ‘hug them all’ the Mutti went for, these thuggish stone throwers wouldn’t be there. But they are there, the driver gets uptight, might even injure one of the boisterous youngsters, and that’s what the politicians love, the unwashed fighting, abusing, hurting each other rather than directing their anger at them. It will give them the opportunity to adjudicate, say things like ‘be civil, tolerant’, invoke the law, the guy will get a visit from the police, be accused of racism or whatever …

    Madness

  187. The Colorado PD press officer is a game gal. Wouldn’t cross her in a major incident; no doubt about who was in charge during that kerfuffle. She should take over the interrogation now that that have the perp in the pokey. I’d lay odds that she’s bite his balls off if he didn’t ‘cooperate. ☺

  188. RobertRetyred @ 00:23

    You shocked, Robert?

    We, or rather those we elect to govern us, should have objected when the idiocy of no border controls, the open border policy, the ‘uman rites’ replacement of our common law were being put in place. That was the root of the rot, the regulation you’ve linked to is but a natural evolution of it.

  189. Baron (00:07)

    I bet the Westminster dykes will have some input into the EU candle regulatory procedures. More about the size and shape, than the effectiveness of the snuffers. Sniffing would take priority over snuffing, perhaps?

  192. Frank P @ 00:49

    Indeed, the ‘small shit’ isn’t the exclusive domain of the Brussels pigeon loft, Frank. If you travel on the trains, at each stop people are warned not to leave anything behind, be careful disembarking, advise, when walking, to put one foot forward, then the other and keep breathing. OK, Baron made the last two bits up, but the rest is true.

    That’s the world today, enjoy.

  196. Further to my (01:11)

    Don’t neglect to scroll down to Gerard’s little anthology of aphorisms after the gun-gal video clip. Wonderful stuff. Particularly appreciated the US aircraft carrier one.

  203. Frank P @ 01:11

    Joking apart, Frank, the barbarian’s in favour of gun ownership for personal protection, but not up to the .45 magnum. The .22 with fully jacketed bullets is more than enough, getting hit is painful enough, but not necessarily lethal.

    As the top cop, you agree?

  204. Frank P @ 11:49

    She looks better than good, she writes better than well, talks even better than that – doesn’t it make you sick, Frank, how unequal this really is in the world that is supposed to be the Full Monty of equality? How come the poorly educated Slav ain’t any it it. Whom could he blame? Quick, please, he hasn’t got much left before he pegs it.

  205. Frank P @ 12:16

    Never mind her legs, her age and all the medical jargon, Frank, what TF is the legal age of consent in Mexico? Fred doesn’t say, the barbarian had to google it, and this is what he got:

    “The federal law establishes the age of 12 as the minimum age of consent, while the age at which there are no restrictions for consensual sexual activities is 18 (sex with someone 12-18 is not illegal per se, but can still be open to prosecution under certain circumstances)”.

    Hmmm, don’t the legs look even more inviting?

  206. Noa @ 14:26

    Good link, Noa, and good argument, too.

    Two of the groups (the Turkmen and the Kurds) have no desire to take any new territory, they have their ancestral lands, are defending them, the two other Sunni groups he mentions comprise of butchers, who are paid by the Arab states, they don’t fight ISIL but co-operate with the ISIL thugs, live ‘in harmony’ with each other because ‘we’re brothers’, and only attack the Assad’s forces. There also are numerous ‘village’ based groups that join anyone ready to pay, they may not be possible to co-opt, many of their members go around their daily business, dig up arms if a lucrative ‘business’ comes along.

    The idea ISIL are mulling over is how to infiltrate the ‘moderates’, get a presence at the talks on Syria’s future. This is a smart move, will the Americans wise up to it, stop it?

    Source: various east European sources.

    Btw, last week, the Americans imposed further sanctions, no, not on ISIL and everyone doing business with them, moving money around for them (ISIL have bank accounts in both Turkey and Jordan), but on Damascus. Unbelievable that, and the KGB Colonel thinks he together with the French soon-to-be-toast still thinks he can win?

  207. Noa @ 15:09

    An even better slicing of the mess that Syria has become than the Independent piece, Noa, the guy who penned it seems to know alot about it.

    Btw, the criticism of Erdogan has focused mostly on the shooting of the bomber. This, in Baron’s humble view, is not the most appealing act, it’s partly the fault of the Russians, the territory they’re flying over is a war zone, they should have ensured a couple of fighters accompany the bombers, they didn’t, got hit, they should lick the wound, ensure it doesn’t happen again, keep in mind that if one plays with fire unprotected, one gets burnt.

    The more significant is the killing of the parachuter, the copter’s crew member by the Turkmen’s ‘moderates’ (the second in command is apparently a Turk, the son of a mayor of a Turkish village over the border, Baron forgot the name). It doesn’t get much of a mention in the Western MSM for it typifies the caliber of the ‘moderates’, butchers as much as are the ISIL thugs.

  209. Baron @ 15:19

    You’ve obviously not thought much beyond your moles as targets in our brave new world.

  210. Now we begin to get the idea…

    “STRASBOURG, France (Reuters) – France has put 24 green activists under house arrest ahead of the United Nations climate talks, using emergency laws put in place following the Paris shootings, Interior Minister Bernard Cazeneuve said on Saturday.
    Cazeneuve said the activists were suspected of planning violent protests at the talks which kick off on Sunday, a day ahead of the opening ceremony, and run until Dec. 11.
    The conference, also dubbed COP21, is seeking to agree a deal that signals a break with a rising reliance on fossil fuels, blamed by a U.N. panel of scientists for causing more floods, heat waves and rising sea levels.
    “These 24 people have been placed under house arrest because they have been violent during demonstrations in the past and because they have said they would not respect the state of emergency,” Cazeneuve said in a speech in Strasbourg.”

    https://ca.news.yahoo.com/france-puts-green-activists-under-house-arrest-ahead-135654386.html

    It ain’t what you do, it’s the way you might do it. Paris,the Beijing of the West.

    A state of emergency in place, too. How convenient.

    And the conference under the imprimatur of “a World Government – whoops!- a UN panel of scientists”.

    I can’t wait to start paying my taxes to the Carbon Trade Exchange…and to forget that in 2011 the beneficiaries of this global scam were called “hucksters” by respectable members of the community:

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/larrybell/2013/11/03/blood-and-gore-making-a-killing-on-anti-carbon-investment-hype/

    Thank God our honourable Energy Secretary is demanding the closure of all coal-fired energy plants by 2020. Amber Rudd was formerly the Parliamentary Under Secretary of State at the Department of Energy and CLIMATE CHANGE.

    ‘O, wonder!
    How many goodly creatures are there here!
    How beauteous mankind is! O brave new world,
    That has such people in’t!’ (Aldous Huxley)

  211. “It is with sadness that I observe that most people – including extremely intelligent and accomplished people – appear to have lost their critical thinking faculties over the past quarter century. When I have the temerity to suggest that Paris may have been a false flag event intended to

    legalize the illegal US war against Syria by invoking the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO) Article 5 protection clause;
    or that it is a means for the party in power in France to lock down the country (neutralizing the extreme right challenging its loose authority);
    or that Saudi Arabia and Turkey gain from international publicity consistent with their export of state-sponsored terrorism;
    or that Israel is always happy to both punish France for supporting the Palestinians and considering a boycott of Israeli products while also frightening more French Jews into moving to Israel to fill up the illegal settlements being built there at U.S. taxpayer expense
    I get three reactions:

    one third tell me that it is high time someone put all this in writing at a time when the mainstream media and even alternative media have been bribed or intimidated into avoiding any challenge to the official narrative;
    one third tell me I am most certainly a lunatic and perhaps a traitor (remember this is how America treated Daniel Elsberg on Viet-Nam and the Dixie Chicks on Iraq); and
    one third don’t notice – they don’t read much and are largely oblivious to world events.
    Me? I think for a living. I am a professional intelligence officer…” READ ON

    http://www.phibetaiota.net/2015/11/robert-steele-was-paris-1113-a-false-flag-event-a-matrix-for-evaluating-possibilities/

  212. By the way, I do not believe that “settlements” in Israel are “illegal” (see above); but that is another matter.

  213. Go see bridge of spies. Good movie.

    I go to berlin a bit and the place makes you think.

    There are the tripstones set in the street where people were taken from to go to camps.

    Then there are the relics of the berlin wall. And things like the memorial to peter fecher who was shot trying to escape from equality in the east. And left to slowly bleed to death while those in w berlin heard his screams.

    Bridge of spies is true and set in the period around 1960.

    But all this shows the evils of states that seek to control our thoughts. And the left and islam want to take us back to the days of national socialism when people died for thinking the wrong the wrong things or having the wrong ancestry, or to walls to stop people seeking freedom. (No one was killed trying to escape from w berlin to the east.)

  215. Malfleur at 23:26

    As I’m sure you know, the quote is originally from Miranda in “The Tempest”.

  216. Alexandr @ 6:11

    Matt Drudge, in the conversation with Alex Jones on 6th October, recognized the merit of Spielberg’s Bridge of Spies but commented “Enough with WW2 alredy!” in bemoaning the absence of film directors of the calibre and vision of Stanley Kubrick willing to take on equivalent contemporary themes to wake up today’s audience and make then think.

    @ 07:47
    Not under Israeli law. Resolutions of gangster states legitimised by “membership of the United Nations” are no law.

    Chris Morriss @ 08:17

    But also from Huxley’s novel setting out the vision now being implemented, or whose implementation is now being attempted.

  217. A Canadian law case is discussed by English journalist, Paul Joseph
    Watson and the defendant’s lawyer, Christopher Murphy, brought by a feminist alleging threats against her by innocuous tweets not aimed at her. If the defendant, a Mr. Chris Elliott, is found guilty the judgment will have grave implications for freedom of the social media in the Anglosphere – such as The Coffee House Wall!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1booGYDIdY

  219. “Yesterday, [Lt. General Tom] McInerney told Fox News – much to the surprise of the reporter interviewing him [DUH!]– that assuming the Turkish version of the flight path of the Russian jet is accurate, Russia wasn’t threatening Turkey, and that Turkey’s shoot down of the Russian jet “had to be pre-planned”, as the jet wasn’t in Turkish air space long enough for anything other than a premeditated attack to have brought it down:” ”
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-27/top-us-air-defense-commander-turkey%E2%80%99s-shootdown-russian-jet-%E2%80%9Chad-be-pre-planned%E2%80%9D

    “McInerney served as:

    Commander of the North American Aerospace Defense Command (Norad) – the military agency responsible for protecting the United States and Canada from foreign jet attacks – for the Alaska region
    Commander of the Alaskan Air Command
    Commander of 11th Air Force in Alaska
    Commander of the 3rd Tactical Fighter Wing, Clark Air Base, Philippines
    Commander of the 313th Air Division, Kadena Air Base, Japan
    Commander of 3rd Air Force, Royal Air Force Station Mildenhall, England
    Vice Chief of Staff of the U.S. Air Force
    A command pilot with more than 4,100 flying hours, including 407 combat missions
    In his role as Norad commander for Alaska, McInerney dealt with more Russian fighter jet incursions (which he calls “bear penetrations”) than anyone else in the world.”

    *****

    Now, Mr. Prime Minister, you are going to invite the House of Commons to vote for Britain to engage in air attacks on ISIS in Syria in the following circumstances:

    1. For more than a year the United States failed to bomb ISIS (formerly Al Qaeda) in Syrian territory, though in mitigation the Syrian government, a member of the United Nations, had not invited it to do so, but it said it would do so anyway, but did not…

    2. Turkey is a member of NATO and thereby an ally of the United Kingdom.

    3. For more than a year ISIS (formerly Al Qaeda) has been stealing oil from Iraq.

    4. For more that a year, Turkey has been buying the stolen oil from ISIS (formerly Al Qaeda).

    5. The funds paid for the oil to ISIS (formerly Al Qaeda) are provided by Bilal Erdogan, the son of President Erdogan of Turkey.

    6. It has been alleged that as a result of the losses incurred by Bilal Erdogan as a result of Russian (and very latterly US) strikes against the oil convoys of ISIS (formerly Al Qaeda), the President of Turkey planned and executed the shooting down of the Russian fighter jet.

    *****

    Not to go into any further particulars surrounding the relation between NATO countries and ISIS (formerly Al Qaeda), Prime Minister Cameron will be asking Members of Parliament to support a policy of RAF air strikes over a country which has not asked Britain for its assistance nor invited it to enter its air space in which it already has the suffiiicient cooperation of its invitee, the Russians.

    The target of these proposed but uninvited attacks by the United Kingdom is engaged in a very profitable, albeit illicit, commercial agreements for the supply of oil to Turkey represented by the Turkish president’s son. Unfortunately, it seems also likely that elements of ISIS (formerly Al Qaeda) will have been with the connivance of persons unknown been allowed to slip into the Unted Kingdom with malevolent intent in some cases perhaps posing as refugees.

    Notwithstanding the latter consideration, the interest of an important NATO ally of the United Kingdom is at stake. Immense financial damage would be caused to Turkey if the flow of oil to President Erdogan’s son was to be interrupted let alone permanently cut off. Considerable damage to Britain’s commercial and diplomatic relations with Turkey would be sustained in such circumstances and perhaps to other alliances of the United Kingdom painstakingly built up by both Labour and Conservative governments over the years.

    The House of Commons should therefore vote in the nation’s interest, as it did two years ago, by refusing to agree to the Prime Minister’s reckless and anti-British proposal for the Royal Air Force to engage ISIS (formerly Al Qaeda).

  220. The hogging of meeja musing this morning by Corbynski and Mad Georgie Gall-away should also be an indicator of just how far down the abyss we have already descended in the rickety handcart to Hades. It Styx in the throat.

  221. Now stand by for the coverage of the gathering of 150 flim-flam operatives masquerading and ‘poilitical leaders’ descending on not-so-Gay Paree. At this very moment on Sky News that daft old sod, the remaining Attenborough, is waffling on about ‘Global Warming’ and imminent doomsday. Why TF doesn’t he stick to photographing simian haemorrhoids and copulating chimps?

  222. Oh dear, with friends like these…!:

    “A day after Turkey arrested two journalists for their report exposing Erdogan’s weapons deliveries to “extremist groups” in Syria, confirming that no dissent to the president’s foreign policy would be allowed, today a new riot has erupted in Istanbul following the dramatic murder in broad daylight of Tahir Elci, the president of the Turkish bar association…”

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-28/violence-erupts-turkey-after-prominent-lawyer-assassinated-live-tv-while-giving-publ

    *****

    “Voters in Britain’s referendum need to understand that the European Union was about building a federal superstate from day one

    As the debate over the forthcoming EU referendum gears up, it would be wise perhaps to remember how Britain was led into membership in the first place. It seems to me that most people have little idea why one of the victors of the Second World War should have become almost desperate to join this “club”. That’s a shame, because answering that question is key to understanding why the EU has gone so wrong.

    Most students seem to think that Britain was in dire economic straits, and that the European Economic Community – as it was then called – provided an economic engine which could revitalise our economy. Others seem to believe that after the Second World War Britain needed to recast her geopolitical position away from empire, and towards a more realistic one at the heart of Europe. Neither of these arguments, however, makes any sense at all……”

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-28/how-secretive-elite-created-eu-build-world-government

    *****

    “Another ‘mass’ shooting, and another outraged statement from President Obama proclaiming “enough is enough.” With 9 injured, and 2 police officers and 1 civilian dead after the dreadful standoff at a Planned Parenthood office in Colorado Springs, the President took the opportunity to explain “we have to do something about the easy accessibility of weapons of war on our streets to people who have no business wielding them. Period.” Of course, any discussion of the shooter’s mental health, the violent polarization towards and politicization of abortion among an increasingly micro-aggressive America were conveniently ignored.f”

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-28/obama-says-enough-enough-urges-gun-restrictions-after-deadly-planned-parenthood-stan

    It would be a breach of the Constitution, you creep!

    Enough is enough alright – enough of this lawless, jihadist, communist psychopath puppet. Time to arrest the man and bring him to trial with the leaders of his administration.

    Or am I the crazy one looking at the finger?

    To paraphrase Lenin at the Finland Station: All power to the States!

  223. Malfleur – 12:06

    You would have thought that the Tories would have had enough bullying stories to be going on with.

  224. “Despite advice from the Lord Chancellor, Lord Kilmuir, that membership would mean the end of British parliamentary sovereignty, Macmillan deliberately misled the House of Commons — and practically everyone else, from Commonwealth statesmen to cabinet colleagues and the public — that merely minor commercial negotiations were involved. He even tried to deceive de Gaulle that he was an anti-federalist and a close friend who would arrange for France, like Britain, to receive Polaris missiles from the Americans. De Gaulle saw completely through him and vetoed the British bid to enter.

    Macmillan left Edward Heath to take matters forward, and Heath, along with Douglas Hurd, arranged — according to the Monnet papers — for the Tory Party to become a (secret) corporate member of Monnet’s Action Committee for a United States of Europe….” (ibid @ 12:42)

  228. The BBC, at its worst, again:
    Farmer spends £15,000 and 12 months trying to prove he actually owns four sheep after being arrested and accused of stealing them on national television
    * Ross Hutchinson’s arrest was filmed for BBC show Countryside 999
    * DNA evidence proved the sheep were his and he was found not guilty
    * His lawyer accused police of being distracted by the cameras
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3338234/Farmer-spends-15-000-12-months-trying-prove-actually-owns-four-sheep-arrested-accused-stealing-national-television.html

  229. Just in time for Paris:

    Cameron told EU negotiations will NEVER happen as Eastern Europe plot to stop benefits cap
    DAVID Cameron’s feeble attempts at EU membership negotiations have yet again been ripped apart as Eastern European countries said plans to reduce benefits for migrants will NEVER HAPPEN.

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/622919/Cameron-told-EU-negotiations-will-NEVER-happen-as-Eastern-Europe-plot-to-stop-benefits-cap

    and …..

    GLOBAL COOLING: Decade long ice age predicted as sun ‘hibernates’

    SCIENTISTS claim we are in for a decade-long freeze as the sun slows down solar activity by up to 60 per cent.
    http://www.express.co.uk/news/science/616937/GLOBAL-COOLING-Decade-long-ice-age-predicted-as-sun-hibernates

  230. John birch @ 13:46

    Really a hard toss-up, which is to go for, John, the feminism promoted by the Bateman’s phylum or that offered by our bearded friends. One can only hope Turkey joins the EU soon, the veiled ‘feminists’ of the ROP have a word with the good Cambridge doctor (only joking).

  231. RobertRetyred @ 18:48

    The boy has now dropped the cap-on-benefit request, Robert, it was a non-starter, nobody, not one of the 27 EU members, has shown any signs of backing him on it.

    More to the point, for Baron there could only be one fundamental change to our relationship with the autocracy of the Brussels pigeon loft – a full sovereignty.

    Baron also bets you, anything you want, that’s a genuine offer even though he hasn’t got much, that even if we all turn benumbed with cold, ice over, glaciate gently and starve because harvests fail, the political wankers will keep on telling us ‘it’s global warming and we’re to blame’.

  232. It may have been a mistake for the German authorities to say publicly the country will process, accept asylum seekers from Syria in preference to others (the only war zone in the ME). This seems to be causing an unrest amongst refugees from other countries, plenty of violent skirmishes, the biggest in a facility near the Tempelhof airport, close to Berlin, housing 2300 immigrants mostly from Afghanistan and Syria, twelve injured, it hasn’t been quelled yet. There’re reports of other incidents, too.

    Germany has also decided to dispatch 100 strong special forces unit to Syria.

  233. RobertRetyred @ 15:56

    It says somewhere in the middle of the PC college statement that ‘the oppression of the College violates their commitment to ensuring equity and excellence in the educational programs for all of our students’. The stress in on ‘excellence’.

    Just watch this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mWtWz_aGyk

    Of course, the USofA hasn’t cornered the market for imbeciles, but the answers of the young in the clip, white and black alike, just beggar belief.

  235. Baron@November 29th, 2015 – 19:16

    Templehof airport is actually in Berlin, not outside it. Its inside the S-bahn ring and in the central zone A public transport zone.

  239. Frank P @ 12:27

    Ask yourself, Frank, what pleases the PC brigade more copulating chimps or yapping about the ‘major threat the mankind has ever encountered’?

  240. It’s very difficult to untangle the labyrinth of conflicting factors in the areas around the Black Sea, but the Russians are reported to have not only imposed economic sanctions in against Turkey, but to have also stationed one of their most powerful and sophisticated missile systems in Syria, close to Syria’s border with Turkey.

    That makes me ask whether the withdrawal of a German operated missile system from Turkey mentioned in this report is more than a mere coincidence –

    https://www.rt.com/news/312559-germany-withdraws-missiles-turkey/

    The question I’ve posed seems to me to be all the more interesting in light of what Peter Hitchens said in his recent speech/lecture (q.v.) about the EU being the continuation of Germany by other means.

    Incidentally, I see that Baron suggests that Turkey would not have shot down the Russian aircraft unless it first had the nod to do so from the U.S. If that’s true it seems to me that somebody in the U.S. has been very foolishly reckless. I incline to believe though that the loose cannon is Turkey’s Islamist government.

  244. I actually agree with Corbyn that Britain should not send bombers over Syria. He of course, has a different agenda to me, but I think bombing Syria would be a pointless enterprise and make no difference to the danger of IS. Far better to bomb Saudi Arabia, but none of the rubbish on both sides of the House would vote for this. Why cannot we have a public referendum and give the electorate a chance to show what they really want?

  245. Baron – 19:31

    Come on, Baron, “Tony Blair IS an actor”!

    Baron – 19:35

    This is more worrying. It may be explained by this:
    http://www.improve-education.org/id69.html

    I have seen articles stating that being taught ‘sight words’ can make children go mental. I empathise because I have found understanding something meant that I didn’t have to remember it. It just ended up in my memory, while remembering any arbitrary text, like poems, religious quotes or Shakespeare was just not my scene.

  246. Frank P @ 20:58

    Weird as it may seem, Frank, James Lewis whom Baron has admired for a long time (he’s one of the best, brightest, clueful commentators on the site) may be pushing it too far, making the KGB Colonel whiter than he deserves, but the gist of the narrative is about right about the other players. Pity he hasn’t mentioned the son of the Turkish top man, it’s his business interest that got hurt (Baron’s still looking for which of the old wealthy Turkish families is backing him, if he hasn’t any backers, the farther better watch out).

  248. “Yesterday, [Lt. General Tom] McInerney told Fox News – much to the surprise of the reporter interviewing him [DUH!]– that assuming the Turkish version of the flight path of the Russian jet is accurate, Russia wasn’t threatening Turkey, and that Turkey’s shoot down of the Russian jet “had to be pre-planned”, as the jet wasn’t in Turkish air space long enough for anything other than a premeditated attack to have brought it down:” ”
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-27/top-us-air-defense-commander-turkey%E2%80%99s-shootdown-russian-jet-%E2%80%9Chad-be-pre-planned%E2%80%9D
    “McInerney served as:
    Commander of the North American Aerospace Defense Command (Norad) – the military agency responsible for protecting the United States and Canada from foreign jet attacks – for the Alaska region
    Commander of the Alaskan Air Command
    Commander of 11th Air Force in Alaska
    Commander of the 3rd Tactical Fighter Wing, Clark Air Base, Philippines
    Commander of the 313th Air Division, Kadena Air Base, Japan
    Commander of 3rd Air Force, Royal Air Force Station Mildenhall, England
    Vice Chief of Staff of the U.S. Air Force
    A command pilot with more than 4,100 flying hours, including 407 combat missions
    In his role as Norad commander for Alaska, McInerney dealt with more Russian fighter jet incursions (which he calls “bear penetrations”) than anyone else in the world.”

  249. “Voters in Britain’s referendum need to understand that the European Union was about building a federal superstate from day one
    As the debate over the forthcoming EU referendum gears up, it would be wise perhaps to remember how Britain was led into membership in the first place. It seems to me that most people have little idea why one of the victors of the Second World War should have become almost desperate to join this “club”. That’s a shame, because answering that question is key to understanding why the EU has gone so wrong.
    Most students seem to think that Britain was in dire economic straits, and that the European Economic Community – as it was then called – provided an economic engine which could revitalise our economy. Others seem to believe that after the Second World War Britain needed to recast her geopolitical position away from empire, and towards a more realistic one at the heart of Europe. Neither of these arguments, however, makes any sense at all……

    ”…“Despite advice from the Lord Chancellor, Lord Kilmuir, that membership would mean the end of British parliamentary sovereignty, Macmillan deliberately misled the House of Commons — and practically everyone else, from Commonwealth statesmen to cabinet colleagues and the public — that merely minor commercial negotiations were involved. He even tried to deceive de Gaulle that he was an anti-federalist and a close friend who would arrange for France, like Britain, to receive Polaris missiles from the Americans. De Gaulle saw completely through him and vetoed the British bid to enter.
    Macmillan left Edward Heath to take matters forward, and Heath, along with Douglas Hurd, arranged — according to the Monnet papers — for the Tory Party to become a (secret) corporate member of Monnet’s Action Committee for a United States of Europe….”
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-11-28/how-secretive-elite-created-eu-build-world-government

  250. Baron @ 19:16

    Don’t you get the feeling that there is a larger plan unfolding – and I don’t mean God’s?

    *****

    Baron @ 20:05

    Good that they were caught; but it would have been better if circumstances had permitted the police to track them to their destination and then monitor their distribution first.

    In the meantime, the coddled and coddling (and in some countries arguably malevolent) governments do not or do not wish to draw the conclusion that citizens are left largely unprotected in our brave new world without the restitution of the right to bear arms. Shouldn’t we also be discussing the principles of a militia – oh, alright, a dad’s army?

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